Friday, February 29, 2008

Recovering from a Cult

Kimkins has been labeled as a cult in several blog posts:
Kimkins Cult Mentality
Kimkins Cult Mentality Revisited
Kimkins - A Cult

And the latest Kimkins defecter, AmyB, is also calling Kimkins a cult on her blog

Magicsmom says: Every one of us who was taken in by Heidi has to go through a process which is exactly like grieving. You go through stages, and I believe it is very similar to this:

The seven stages of grief are:

* Shock or Disbelief
* Denial
* Bargaining
* Guilt
* Anger
* Depression
* Acceptance and Hope

Why do people leave? How do people leave?

Members typically:

1. walk away

2. are thrown out (banned)

3. lose their group to dissolution

4. or are convinced to leave by outside people

in roughly that numerical order.

"Walkaways" may leave gradually because of love for family or friends or what is called "cognitive dissonance" — a growing realization that the ideals of the group are at odds with their actions. They may float into new groups or eventually return to their original group. Frequently they do not face the damage that they have endured, and they experience reduced functionality for many, many years.

Banned members are tossed out by their leaders or groups for real or imagined offenses — or to keep other members in line. This group may experience the most traumatic re-entrance into mainstream society. They usually have not rejected the beliefs or leader of their group and have the added guilt and shame of having been rejected.

Someone involved in the disbandment of their group may experience an ego-strengthening sense of power and control. If the group disbanded against their wishes, they may experience a depth of despair similar to a castaway (banned).

Those who are counseled out, through persuasions, or the like, usually experience the smoothest and quickest recovery.

reFOCUS: Recovering Former Cultists' Support Network

The keys to recovery after leaving a high-demand group or cult are:

Education or knowledge

Support

Patience

Education

The over-riding factor is education: educating oneself about what happened to you while in the group and why it still affects you after you leave. Its crucial to understand the techniques that were used to gain your compliance, to shut down your critical thought processes, to manipulate your experiences and your emotions, to isolate you psychologically and sometimes physically from gaining information and feedback from the world outside the group. These techniques have an effect for quite some time after you leave the group. And it is important to understand that these lasting effects are normal under the circumstances, and that they will begin to dissipate once you do understand them and can begin to unravel them.

Support

It is so important to build a support team for yourself. Look for people who are willing to learn and to be there for you when you need to talk or to just spend some time together. The most powerful support can be found in other former members of groups have had very similar experiences to your own and are going through the recovery process as well. It is so good to be around people who really get it!

Patience

Yes, I know it is hard to be patient with yourself in the recovery process. Remember, we had a lot of practice living on the edge and being expected to produce results yesterday. A residual effect of living that way is to expect recovery yesterday and to be very impatient with ourselves. Also, remember when you were in the group, the leaders or the ideology could never be wrong if something was wrong, guess who it was! So, we tend to say whats wrong with me in the recovery process. Guess what. There is nothing wrong with you. Recovery takes time. It takes education. It takes support. And it takes giving yourself a break.

Edited to add:
A comment reminded me that I didn't fully finish this post.

While I have no problem calling Kimmer and Singing Ass "Cult Leaders" (even if the latter is just a wannabe) I do not want to attach the label cult to the former Kimkins members.

While many Kimkins members that leave go through stages of feelings that are similar to people that are leaving a cult, Kimkins did not encompass the member's entire life in the same way as a religious cult so the "recovery" process should be easier.

I also forgot to include links to where to find support and to meet up with other people that have left or been banned from Kimkins:
  • Low Carb Friends has an active thread with people trying to shut Kimkins.con down. Kimkins discussions are detained to this one thread. Many ex-kimkinites find it a useful place to vent anger while others see it as Kimkins bashing. Then you might want to find one of the many diet support groups on LCF instead.
  • Jimmy Moore's forum is a meeting place for many ex-kimkinites but the Kimkins Diet is strongly discouraged.
  • Amy Eating Low is also a forum where many ex-kimkinites hang out, including Amy herself.




Monday, February 25, 2008

Infamous Diet

in·fa·mous
– adjective
1. having an extremely bad reputation
2. deserving of or causing an evil reputation; shamefully malign; detestable

Kimkins certainly qualifies as an "Infamous Diet". Read what Consumer Affairs has to say about it:
Kimkins Diet Rolls On Despite Founder's Excess Poundage

The article by Consumer Affairs is a result of the complaints submitted by the Ducks as part of the "Take Down Kimkins Contest" on Kimkinsscam.

What is interesting with the Consumer Affair's article is that it is written by someone, David Wood, that had no previous knowledge of the diet. David was given a free pass to kimkins.com and commented:

"Our time on the Kimkins website showed that many people didn't care that many if not most of the claims were bogus. It was a cult atmosphere, with people attacking anyone that dared speak against Heidi and her diet. And although the membership fee is supposed to pay for a lifetime membership, we spoke with numerous people who had been banned from the site.

We also saw the consequences of a classic starvation diet. Women who had quickly lost the weight started eating again, and then returned to the Kimkins site for encouragement to lose the weight again."

Apparently, the new sockpuppets Heidi created on Kimkins just before David's arrival did not fool him one bit, just as the "cleaned up" version of kimkins.com still doesn't make the diet any better.

Saturday, February 23, 2008

Reinforcing the Cult

Kimkins is often compared to a cult, as the community within the pay site ($79.95 membership) has a lot of similarities to a cult. See for yourself:
Kimkins Cult Mentality
Kimkins Cult Mentality Revisited
Kimkins - A Cult

How can we recognize a cult?

A fair use of the cult label for a questionable organization would require the presence of most of the items on the following checklist.

Does the group:
  • engage in deceptive recruitment practices?
  • tend to target vulnerable individuals?
  • offer unconditional affirmation and support initially, but soon make its continuance contingent on obedience?
  • have a closed social system that makes a special effort to isolate acolytes from family, friends, etc.?
  • use constant bombardment with pro-group and pro-leader messages and exclusion of other messages?
  • have a rigid, authoritarian hierarchy?
  • have a leader and ruling clique that are perceived to possess infallible insight, supernatural powers, etc.?
  • have an eclectic, often muddled and internally contradictory, set of teachings - usually a magic-laden philosophy that claims to have infallible answers to those “big ticket” questions of existence?
  • have a strict behavior code that governs all aspects of how one should think, feel, and act?
  • instill fear of outsiders (the “bunker mentality”)? Does the group try to convince members they are powerless to act without the group’s support and that the world “out there” is uncaring and hostile?
A post yesterday by the Kimkins poster girl Singing Lass reinforces the image of a cult. The post was made in response to emails that concerned people had sent to a Kimkins dieter with a heart condition.

"I am so proud of you---you are such a beautiful and strong person, and are inspiring so many people because of it. I know right now is a difficult time to step outside the 'safety walls" of the inner site and proclaim yourself with the plan, and it just reflects all the more on your courage and spirit---and the desire to help others who feel hopeless or overwhelmed with their need for weight loss by sharing your personal story and journey.

As for the "others". What they do is the complete opposite---playground bully tactics of harassment and threats. It is obsessive and juvenile, and perhaps they should look to their own selves and lives for things to "fix" before trying to condem and force themselves and their opinions on others. We are adults, we should have the right to make our own choices, especially in regard to OUR own bodies ... they have no right to tell others what to do. Some of them lost weight on this plan, then after the fact joined the hate party, many never did the diet at all ..... and many more are stuck with weight issues, unable to stick to diets of their own, or reporting having gone to surgical means and having resulting infections and problems ..... while here you are, beautiful, losing, getting on your feet with your heart health etc ... You have every right to hold your head up and be proud for who you are and what you have accomplished.

I had my share of the bully tactics and harassment. I guess, I realized to give in, to step down like they wanted me to .... would have been condoning their tactics and would have made them the"winners". People who harass, threaten, say mean things/ make fun of people should not be given any satisfaction or justifcation for the tactics they employ. I think the real test is being strong, sticking to what you feel is right for you and what makes you feel good, and not letting obsessed people change that, or take it away from you. The real people who care about you are here ... the ones that have be-friended you without any motives, who show genuine concern and caring .... not people who pile up on you all of a sudden with threats etc ...

My advice still is the same regarding blocking their emails, just turn them off. Do not respond to them-----do not feed the animals. I know its a bit like a bad tv show that you hate, but cant bring yourself to change the channel just to see how much worse they will take it. It is all hot air, spite, jealousy etc ... though. You cannot reason with them. The only response I would even suggest giving any of them is an email saying you do not wish to have any interaction/communication from them, and any further attempts on their part will be reported to the police for harassment. Guess what.. .. it is very much against the law for them to continue to do so. When you cut off the fuel, ignore them .. .they get bored waving their fingers at a wall, do not get any satisfaction, and get a knot in their holy crusader underwear and move on .... unfortunately looking for new targets and meat to sink teeth into. but still.. .... the best way to fight it is to ignore, stick to guns, not let them make choices for you, and thusly it results in not allowing them to win or feel like they have any power over you.

You know, these same people who do this ..... I wonder how they would react if they were to get a report from school, or the parents of other kids telling them that their children are harassing other kids, making threats, bullying, emailing etc ... It is total school ground tactics that are typically discouraged and even punished when discovered in children. yet here they are. Great examples. I hope they feel proud of themselves."

Meet the Cult Leaders: The Kimmer, Singing Lass and sockpuppet Gary:


Emphasis mine, typos Singing Lass'.

Laxatives for Weight Loss

It's a MYTH. Since most of the calories eaten are absorbed by the small intestine right after eating, the method of using laxatives for weight loss is actually ineffective. Many laxatives act by irritating the lining of the intestines or by directly stimulating nerves. Continual over stimulation of the intestines form laxative abuse can eventually cause the bowels to become non-responsive.

Long term laxative use can damage the colon. Because of the damage that laxatives can cause, ever increasing dosages of laxatives may be needed in order to achieve the desired effect. Where one laxative dose produced results, now two, then three doses a day or more, are required. At this point, the habit has become fixed. The individual is unable to move their bowel without the use of a laxative or other bowel interventions.

So why do people use laxatives for weight loss? In the words of a girl recovering from an eating disorder:

Well, because laxatives cause a body to lose WATER WEIGHT and thus, when first used, appear to assist in weight loss. However, it is NOT REAL WEIGHT that is being lost. Every calorie consumed is still digested by the body, you simply lose more water than usual because the laxatives induce soft stool by adding water to the stool. That's the "secret" that has KILLED a number of people. Stupid water weight that you will GAIN right back as soon as you re-hydrate yourself (by drinking no calorie water). It's a LIE that laxatives cause any real weight loss. Ask a doctor if you don't believe me. In addition to this outrageous lie, laxatives are PHYSICALLY ADDICTING. That means, if you use them your body will start to depend on them in order to have a normal bowel movement. Your colon muscles will get lazy and you'll have to take laxatives just to be normal and the number of actual laxatives needed will increase as well. This cycle is VICIOUS and can absolutely RUIN your life without any "benefit" of weight loss that is lasting or real, and, in fact, there is a risk of weight GAIN.

There are numerous reports from Kimkins how laxatives are being pushed by Kimmer. Why is she doing this? Is it to boost the spirit of the dieter due to the immediate, imaginary weight loss that results? Or is she just plain evil?


Kimmer has a long history of recommending laxative abuse. A few examples from the "Ask Kimmer" thread on LCF:

"Reminder to everybody as to whether epsom salts or other laxative is necessary? We want to keep things moooooving, so to speak."

---

"I think fiber slows down weight loss initially because it's bulking in the colon, absorbing water and "slowing things down" when new food is eaten. Think of the commercials for drain cleaners.

You're still losing, it's just takes awhile for everything to "work through" and this can be a hard thing for someone checking the scale. Suddenly there will be a "whoosh" and it's just everything catching up, so to speak.

Traditional advice is that laxatives are not for daily use because the digestive system will depend on them, but I've read new info (don't have a source) which says that's old science. The opinion was that it was more important to keep waste moving. We're talking the stated dose, not mass quantities or laxative abuse."

---

"You might consider MoM, epsom salt or other laxative either full strength 2-3 times a week or a reduced amount daily. Are you diabetic? "

---

"Keep in mind that meat, chicken & fish have zero fiber so there's nothing to "push them through".

Have you considered taking a mild laxative each night you're doing "protein only"? Or, hate to even suggest it, make up a batch of the horrible Epsom salt solution and take a couple tablespoons each night?

How much have you been losing each day before? You're still losing that right now. When things "move", you'll have a whoosh that will bring you up to date."

---

Question: I've had to use a laxative three times in the past two weeks, which I've never had to do before. When I bought them I was thinking it would be a one time deal, get things moving, and all would be well. Not so, I guess. I've heard mention of epsom salt tonics. Are they less harsh than a laxative? How often are people taking the epsom salt? Do you take it nightly? Or as needed? Is either the epsom salt or the laxatives used on a regular basis harmful? Also, I've stayed the same weight for a three days now. Can I assume that is due to the backup? Fun stuff

Kimmer: My guess would be, 'yes', to the back up.

Low carb is also low fiber so we have the option of taking extra fiber (sugar free Citrucel or Benefiber) with plenty of fluids or an "active" laxative like Ex-lax, epsom salts or something similar. They work in different ways, some bulking, some water attracting and others.

I'm cheap so I would use the epsom salts. Make a batch according to the directions on the box and keep it in the fridge. It tastes horrible so use Crystal Light or diet soda instead of water when you mix.

Personally, I'd drink 4 oz every night, but check on the timing according to how your body reacts. The point is to keep waste moving, as unpleasant as it is to think about."

---

And when someone questions her advice: I don't want to be negative, but I've seen a lot of dancers get dependent on laxatives, and have problems as they get older. An MRI will show how the colon is stained and damaged by many over the counter products used long term. Not the healthiest choice.Psyllium fiber needs lots of water to work right but has no dependence issues. $3.99 pound at Trader Joes. Slightly more expensive under brand names.By perscription only is the very best choice for those with coverage. Enulose is a non digestible agent that draws water into the colon, completely unabsorbed by the body, doesn't cause any dependency issues, extensively used in pediatric and adult medicine with reams of data supporting it's safety. Very $$$ RX for those without coverage though.

Senna is in the group of stimulants which the body eventually developes an attenuation to.
Not saying they won't work, just not the optimal choice for long term use.

Kimmer: Very good point about laxative abuse. We aren't interested in going there, but we are interested in maximum speedy weight loss.

I think laxatives used per instructions are safe and far better than constipation where the body reabsorbs some of the toxins and waste that are accumulated.

Do you think the staining of the colon is from the laxatives themselves or compaction of the fecal matter or bouts of poor eating and then relying on laxatives to maintain weight?"

---

As always with Kimkins, it's weight loss at any cost. It's just not obvious what the cost is at the time. Kimkins Survivors has many examples what the cost was for unsuspecting Kimkins dieters.

That laxatives are not even useful for weight loss is apparently of no importance to Kimmer. Anything to make the scale go down, if only temporarily.

If you are abusing laxatives, this thread has good information. Probiotics may help to restore the intestinal microflora balance.

Friday, February 22, 2008

Diet Founder


Does it matter if a founder of a Diet is following his/her own program, and has been successful on the diet?

For the current Kimkins followers, it doesn't seem so.

Unlike founders of popular diet programs such as Atkins, the South Beach Diet, Weight Watchers and Jenny Craig, this particular diet "guru" has failed at her own program and has not lost weight. Even the ridiculous Magic Chicken Diet was founded by someone that, by all accounts, did lose weight, even if she didn't do it in a healthy manner.

At the height of the Kimkins "craze" last summer a PI took the below picture of Kimmer. Why would anyone take diet advice from this woman? Does she look like she knows what she is talking about? Does she look like she ever lost weight and managed to maintain her weight loss for some time? Does her image represent the results from the Kimkins diet?

Remember that Kimmer promoted this diet for 8 (eight) years, without being successful on it. Why does she still believe in this diet? She never could follow it. She never lost weight on it, except a few pounds that were quickly regained. Has not her results (or rather lack of results) proved to her that the diet does not work and is not sustainable long term?



After Kimmer was forced to stop using fake pictures, of herself and other "success stories", she resorted to Plan B: Elicit sympathy from other dieters that well know how easy it is to fall off the wagon and "regain" weight. Now the message changed from "do what I say to accomplish what I did" to "do what I say and we'll lose weight together". It's just that Kimmer doesn't seem to be losing weight, unless you believe her doctored pictures. So is the message really "do as I say because I say so"? Why would you?

And what is the purpose of the latest addition to the Kimmer pictures? Even if it is her, why is it relevant that she at one time, 35 years ago, was not obese? What does that have to do with the Kimkins diet? Will you pay me $79.95 if I put up a picture of myself as a teen?


Saturday, February 16, 2008

Internet Trolls

Wikipedia:
An Internet troll, or simply troll in Internet slang, is someone who posts controversial and usually irrelevant or off-topic messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum, with the intention of baiting other users into an emotional response or to generally disrupt normal on-topic discussion.

Heidi Diaz, aka Kimmer of Kimkins, is causing a lot of turbulence in the online lowcarb community. Is Kimmer a troll herself? For sure she has appeared as a troll under different names on LCF on numerous occasions. Even on Kimkins, as we well remember Wonderwoman and Melt's rants.

Wikipedia:
Trolling is a game about identity deception, albeit one that is played without the consent of most of the players. The troll attempts to pass as a legitimate participant, sharing the group's common interests and concerns; the newsgroups members, if they are cognizant of trolls and other identity deceptions, attempt to both distinguish real from trolling postings, and upon judging a poster a troll, make the offending poster leave the group. Their success at the former depends on how well they — and the troll — understand identity cues; their success at the latter depends on whether the troll's enjoyment is sufficiently diminished or outweighed by the costs imposed by the group.

The Ducks on the Fascination with Kimmer thread are repeatedly accused of being unwelcoming to newbies and labeling any not previously known person as a troll. Prudentia calls it Friendly Fire.

So why would the Ducks react this way? It is all Heidi's doing! Kimmer is to blame!

MissMerize said:
I have come across other people getting scammed on the web, but the difference was that it was just a financial scamming. When a thing affects your physical and mental health I think it is in a whole other category. Heidi came in like an odorless poisonous gas. She used pictures and words to describe herself as a breath of fresh air. It wasn't until we all inhaled it for a while that we got sick. We were lured into a false sense of security. We appeared to be getting healthier at first and that led us to inhale more and more of the noxious fumes. Fumes like these can change the brain chemistry.

Most of us that have been touched by Kimmer's scam, whether we did the Kimkins Diet or not, have gotten a rude awakening with regards to trusting internet posters on bulletin boards. It was so easy for Kimmer to convince us that she was who she pretended to be. Hardly anybody questioned her as a person, or questioned her success as a dieter during the 6 years she posted on LCF. Why would we? There didn't seem to be any reason for her to be dishonest. Now, we know better. Heidi is a Lying Liar that Lies.

Wikipedia:
A troll can disrupt the discussion on a newsgroup, disseminate bad advice, and damage the feeling of trust in the newsgroup community. Furthermore, in a group that has become sensitized to trolling — where the rate of deception is high — many honestly na├»ve questions may be quickly rejected as trollings. This can be quite off-putting to the new user who upon venturing a first posting is immediately bombarded with angry accusations.


Is it strange then that the hackles come up when a new poster appears on the scene? Especially if this poster has an opposing opinion or is using confusing language? How would we know that it's not a troll? While the common advice is "do not feed the troll" I personally think this is necessary in order to find out if it's a troll or not.

And one final quote from Wikipedia:
Godwin's Law: "As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler approaches one."

Hmm. Didn't Tippy Toes refer to the Ducks as "terrorists"?

Thursday, February 14, 2008

Wednesday, February 13, 2008

Game of Chicken


The phrase game of Chicken is used as a metaphor for a situation where two parties engage in a showdown where they have nothing to gain, and only pride stops them from backing down.

This seems to be an accurate description of what's going on with the Magic Chicken Diet lately.

The Magic Chicken Diet popped up on our radar in December and was brought to our attention only because the site was made as a clone to Kimkins. There are thousands of diet sites promoting fad diets on the internet and the only reason MCD attracted any interest was due to the similarities with Kimkins. Apart from the cloned site, the "catch terms" on the front page could have been directly taken from the Kimkins site, and perhaps they were. The similarities are carrying over to the FAQ page where issues that Kimkins has come under scrutiny for are addressed. For example "consult you doctor" and "no, we don't promote laxatives".

When MCD was first discussed on LCF, a former Kimkins admin, Becky, came out to defend the Chicken Lady. She seemed to have intimate knowledge of the Magic Chicken Diet and it's founder as she said:

"They can like it or not, but she was not a fraud, she was successful and real, and was well within her rights to start a business selling her diet. Contrary to their misinformed opinion, anyone can sell a diet, without a doctor or nutritionist affiliated, as long as it is within minimal safe legal standards, which hers was (and Kimkins isn't). She stated up front what the diet was better than Kimmer did (low carb, low cal, low fat), offered more support and more caution than Kimmer did, and kept calories higher, up within the range of MANY commercial diets that operate freely and unimpeded. The site cost her money she may or may not have recouped, and it certainly deprived her overnight of a stream of revenue she no doubt counted on. She has lost her business (and hopes of funding reconstructive surgery, apparently) right before what should have been her busiest season."

Fraud? I'm not aware of anyone that has questioned that Bonnie lost her weight, and we don't have a problem with it. We just don't like the diet, and should be allowed to say so.

Minimal safe legal standards? Kept calories higher? Just because you state that the diet provides 800 - 1200 calories doesn't make it so. Look at the sample menus. There is no way to get 800 calories following the suggested menu. And the calorie limit isn't stated on the front page or the FAQ, just on the menu page that's available to members only (and to yucky's friend's cousin, apparently - but that menu wasn't posted until several days after Becky's post).

She stated up front what the diet was better than Kimmer did? Yes, it did say low carb, low fat, low cal on the front page (it no longer does, by the way) but why is that different than Kimmers low carb, low cal that is clearly stated on the non-member section of Kimkins?

Offered more support? How would we know, before paying $69.95 to find out? It still says "introduction price for the first 200 members". There surely isn't much member support if there are not even 200 members on the site.

Deprived her overnight of a stream of revenue? With not yet 200 members? When the price went up from $19.95 to $69.95 just days before we blogged about the MCD so that any existing members must have paid the lower price? When there is absolutely no marketing of this site, unless Bonnie sells it on her candle route?

Her busiest season? For candles or the diet site? Again, there was NO marketing I could find of the MCD website.

??????????????????????

Then we have the recent events on the Magic Chicken Diet dot Net site. Something is terribly wrong there, but for what reason, I have no idea. Diversion? From what, and why?

The appearance of the recent troll on LCF coinciding with the MCD dot Net rant? And, the troll's blog? With comments from the troll originating from Fresno, CA that provides Heidi's internet service?

??????????????????????

Would Tippy Toes be involved in the MCD dot Com site? For some reason, the self-proclaimed son-in-law, Hulon, found it necessary to comment on Jimmy Moore's interview with Tippy where the MCD was just mentioned. There wasn't even anything bad said about it.

Tippy was at the time looking for a new "home", being shunned by the lowcarb community as a whole. Perhaps she found it at MCD. Surely, the Chicken Lady could use some more success stories and to get a poster girl that has been on National TV, promoting another starvation diet, would be quite a scoop for Bonnie. And, I'm sure Tippy wouldn't mind another paying job.

Monday, February 11, 2008

Sockpuppets

Wikipedia:

A sockpuppet is an online identity used for purposes of deception within an Internet community. In its earliest usage, a sockpuppet was a false identity through which a member of an Internet community speaks while pretending not to, like a puppeteer manipulating a hand puppet.

In current usage, the perception of the term has been extended beyond second identities of people who already post in a forum to include other uses of misleading online identities. For example, a NY Times article claims that "sock-puppeting" is defined as "the act of creating a fake online identity to praise, defend or create the illusion of support for one’s self, allies or company."

The key difference between a sockpuppet and a regular pseudonym is the active exploitation of the pretense that the puppet is a third party who is not affiliated with the puppeteer.



I was an early member of Kimkins (June 2006) but soon lost interest and didn't return to the board until the controversy started in July 2007. I immediately was surprised by the large number of "success in progress" stories that seemed unbelievable. The more I read, the more unbelievable it became.

Unbelievable is really the keyword here. Yes, I know that you see huge, quick losses on a low carb diet in the beginning, especially if the starting weight is high. But these people were happily posting for weeks while they survived on 400 - 500 calories, never had a stall, never had any problems sticking to the diet, never had craving, never were hungry, never complained about not feeling well. Unbelievable. I have been posting daily on lowcarb boards for 4 years, and I have never seen anything like it.

These posters also lacked personality. They were just reporting on their menu, their weight loss and how happy they were with the diet. Again, a characteristic I did not recognize from other boards where you get to know your fellow posters pretty quickly, or at least get some sense of the person behind the keyboard.

I'm sure the majority of these successful posters were Kimmer sockpuppets. Her admins at the time of the big inrush of new members when the WW magazine came out report that Kimmer hardly posted at the time. I think she did, just not using the name Kimmer. She was busy inventing fictional characters and posting as all these sockpuppets that created a happy and positive atmosphere.

I can just imagine how the members felt about themselves when they read those posts with their shiny lies -- "Other people are doing so well, what's wrong with me? I need to try harder, I need to eat less, I must be the only one who's failing, or the only one who's feeling so ill..."

I'm not sure the use of sockpuppets constitute fraud in the legal sense, but it is certainly unethical. Kimmer is using sockpuppets to promote her business, for her own gain.

In addition to the success stories, there recently has been a large number of a different type of sockpuppets. These are "newbies", not all new members but all with few posts. They seem to be used as "fillers" to promote the sense of more active members on the site. They are characterized by either having a generic avatar or a distorted one, similar to this:



Now, this could be due to technical difficulties, similar to what Tippy Toes once had:
Well we are having some kind of tech problem. Don't laugh but I had changed my avitor from the bikini pic to one in a black dress. This morning when I logged on the pic was all stretched out like a fun mirror at the circus. I looked like I gained all 112 lbs back overnight, RFLMAO! Now I have this flower till I figure out what happened. Still laughing!

This is a weight loss board. Would you post a picture that shows you a lot heavier than you are? Tippy didn't. She replaced the picture until tech support had helped her post it so it showed up in right proportions. So why are these distorted avatars so common on Kimkins? It's obvious that they originally were 3x5 pictures that got posted as 5x5. Here is the original of the above picture:


Is Kimmer starting to be sloppy? Doesn't care anymore to keep up appearances? The remaining members don't care, or all they all sockpuppets? I think it's a combination of all of these.

Sunday, February 10, 2008

Magically Crazy Chicken


The Magic Chicken Diet site that was made into a Kimkins clone has been a source of mystery since it was found a couple of months back. A few days ago, someone that is intimately familiar with the Chicken Lady, Bonnie Luper, made a number of disturbing posts on the "sister site", magicchicken.net. What the purpose of this is, I have no idea.

The posts are made to look as if they were written by Bonnie's husband, David. David, or whoever poses as him, indicates that we bloggers think that Bonnie should have stayed fat and that we are trying to prevent her from selling her diet and making a success of her site.

What are we interfering with? There has been no marketing at all of the Magic Chicken Diet, unless you count what has been written on our blogs. Nobody can find the site unless they would happen to stumble over it on a google search, and it would be buried pretty deep unless you were specifically looking for Magic Chicken. And when finding the site, what would convince you to part with your money? Bonnie's success certainly seems real, but she is just one person without any credentials and can only offer advice based on her own experience, which mainly seems to be eating chicken for breakfast, lunch and dinner.

Is there a maintenance plan? Anybody can lose weight by starving herself, but how is the weight loss going to be sustained? Is Bonnie still eating as she did when she lost the weight? I would think so. Seems like a miserable, and unhealthy, way of life to me.

And, our problem is not with Bonnie, it's with Bonnie's diet. It's eerily similar to the Kimkins starvation diet, and while people have the right to eat how they choose, should they not at least be informed of what they are getting before they pay the $59.95 membership fee for this site?

Here is an example of a day's menu:
Breakfast: 1 boiled egg, 1 turkey sausage
snack: 1 plum (2")
Lunch: 1 can of tuna with 2 pickle spears
Dinner: 1 can of chicken, broccoli, mushrooms, cheese with a small side salad
Snack: 1 SF jello (The menu called for 1 SF popsicle but I couldn't make myself buy it. The sugar alcohols from just one would have me in agony in the bathroom for hours.)

There is a recipe for the dinner casserole:
Drain chicken and mushrooms
Arrange everthing on a plate, put cheese on top (less than 1 carb) and microwave until hot.
(I didn't cook it as just the thought of canned chicken makes me nauseous. I'll feed the can to the dog. My cat likely would refuse it.)

Totals for one day:
Calories 612
Fat 18
Carbs 24
Protein 77

According to Bonnie, the diet guidelines are 800 - 1200 calories per day. This suggested menu is very specific in amounts, and only provides 612 calories.

This is just another starvation diet, just like Kimkins.

Saturday, February 9, 2008

Maintaining Weight Loss

Any VLDC (Very Low Calorie Diet) such as Kimkins will cause you to lose weight. How could it not? Eating 500, or even 800, calories per day has to result in weight loss. Your body is burning calories whether they come from food or your stored fat/muscle.

If you start at a high weight, the first week's losses is probably going to be astounding; perhaps 10 pounds. But that is common for any low carb diet, Atkins for example, and is mostly water from the body depleting its glycogen stores and the water tied to them. Nevertheless, it's thrilling to see the scale go down so quickly, and seeing the big losses becomes addictive. You are not too hungry either, at least not in the beginning, due to ketosis.

The fast weight loss is very motivating for continuing the starvation diet, despite feeling tired, nauseous, dizziness, dry skin, hair loss, menstrual changes and other issues that are soon showing up. As Kimmer herself has said, you have to take a "hit" during the weight loss period as it, in her mind, is more dangerous to stay fat. (I do wonder why she never thought that was valid for herself, but that is a different post all together.)

When serious hunger start to develop, typically around week 5-6, you are already addicted to seeing a daily loss, so you forge ahead, ignoring that the body is demanding nutrition.

Many people drop out, giving in to the body's demands for FOOD, and end up feeling like a failure (see their stories at Kimkins Survivors). Others manage to "ride it out" by filling their stomach with no, or low, calorie foods such as diet soda, broth or egg whites. It will not stave off the hunger, but at least fills the stomach for a while.

A few of the Kimkins dieters manage to stay with the diet all the way to GOAL! Their body might not look exactly as they had envisioned, especially if they followed Kimmer's advice not to exercise during the weight loss period. But hey, they are SKINNY.

So what now? WHAT NOW? How and what will you eat to stay at goal, to stay slim?

Maintenance. Hmm, there is no maintenance plan. Kimmer said, when asked by Jimmy Moore:

Jimmy: One of the questions, Kimmer, that I’m getting from a lot of people is, alright Jimmy you’re doing this, and you’re doing your own little tweaks with it as everybody should (K: Mmm hmm.), what are you gonna do once you lose the weight, for long-term weight maintenance? And that’s a question they wanna hear, how do you transition from Kimkins the weight loss plan to Kimkins the maintenance plan?

K: ‘K, well in the simplest sense, you can transition to any lowcarb plan, if that’s easier for you. (J: Yeah.) My struggle with coming up with a maintenance plan is coming up with something that is super simple. What I have found from studying the website is that even the Kimkins diet, which I think is ultra-simple, that people still have problems deciphering what the rules are, and interpreting what they should do in, in different situations. I’m working with different people now, that we can come up with something, and it’s something that you could write on the back of your hand and you would know always, how to maintain your weight, without — I can’t even follow Dr. Atkins’ plan of 5-carb increments, because there’s 5 carbs in a serving of asparagus, and there’s 5 carbs in a half a cup of cream cheese. The calories are wildly different, weight maintenance will be wildly different. (J: Yeah.) So it’s, it’s in progress.

There is still no maintenance plan posted on Kimkins. Of course, we now know that Kimmer never needed one herself as she has never lost weight and didn't have to bother about maintenance.

There was a maintenance plan in the works, by Christin, before she left Kimkins. (Her thread has since been removed.) It's been almost a year since the Women's World cover girl, Christin, reached goal. So where is she today?
This is what she said yesterday on her blog post My Confession:
It is time for me to share something with you. I am coming clean about the excruciating difficulty that I have had in maintaining my weight loss that I obtained utilizing a Very Low Calorie Diet such as Kimkins. The road has been far from an easy transition. We think when we are on the road to losing weight that once we attain our goal that life will somehow magically get easier.

And the other Women's World cover girl, Deni, said this on December 19th:
I have not maintained well since Kimkins. I am up almost 20 pounds from my low and struggling daily to get some of them off. I instantly gained the 5.. and have slowly yo-yo'd the other 15 pounds ever since.
I have been open about this in my journal and in my challenge thread.

And, finally, the staunch Kimkins supporter, Tippy Toes, that went on the Mike&Juliet show to promote Kimkins said yesterday:
I don't know what I am doing anymore. My weight seems to have decided to be 153 as a new set point. 5 lbs over where it once was.
I mentioned in my journal (I think) that according to my calender I did maintain 147 for 3 months. But in taking a second look, I realized this was the 3 months I worked for Kimkins. I maintained at 147 BUT I was buckling down like crazy doing various K plans trying to reach 145 which never happened.
So, if all that did was maintain me at 147, well, that's not good as I don't want Kimkins to ever be THE maintenance plan!
Shocked.
Am wondering if this is my natural, true weight. I will continue with clean eating and see what the sunday weigh in (which I will record) will bring.
I know I could probably lose it again, either doing a short K round, Stillman's or perhaps just limiting calories to 1000 a day. But, if I cannot easily maintain it why bother? lol
I just don't know what to do, or for that matter, if I need to do anything at all. I guess it's that 5lb span that has me so worried as now I have NO SPAN left. Course I could change it. Maybe my body is OK and my head is the problem. I just don't know.

And I reported recently that another "successful" Kimkins dieter, Gary, is maintaining since 3 months on 800 calories. He is a 230lbs, 6'3" man!

When you reach your goal weight on a VLDC calorie diet, you will have problems finding a maintenance level. Eating like a "normal" person? Not a chance! Any increase of calories will inevitably end up in a weight gain. Are you prepared to continue on a starvation diet for the rest of your life, just to stay slim?

If you have fallen into the Kimkins trap, please read this thread on LCF: Repairing your metabolism.
"The good news is that any damage you did by messing around with your metabolism can be corrected with exercise and the Atkins lifestyle. How long it takes e will depend on how far down the path you have traveled, and for how long. Just know it can and has been done successfully by all of us. "

There is hope, but unfortunately it's not an easy process to get back to healthy eating, or healthy weight loss, after having followed Kimkins.

Do yourself a favor and chose a diet like Atkins. You can lose weight just as fast on Atkins as on Kimkins without deprivation and gradually ease into maintenance that you can stay on for life.

From Repairing your metabolism:
Reaching your goal weight is not—or should not be—about dieting. It's about changing your body, and your mind-set, permanently and for the better. It is—or should be—actually just the opposite of the start-and-stop process that most people consider a diet. I tell my patients that they should plan not just on losing weight, but also on restoring energy and feeling their physical best. All they have to do is exercise regularly, start an intelligent nutritional supplementation plan and eat the healthiest foods imaginable. Sound like a lot? Hardly. In fact, it sounds like a cinch.

Thursday, February 7, 2008

Crazy Magic Chicken

I don't really know how to comment on what going on over at magicchickendiet.net
Well, it's obvious that David Luper (or whoever it is) is mighty upset with yucky. For what, I have no idea.

It's not like the Magic Chicken Diet was making business and that blogging about it interfered with their plans. Or did it?

Wednesday, February 6, 2008

Kimkins Food

Apparently, even Kimmer thought this Kimkins K/E meal I showed the other day looked miserable. But at least it was MY photo and cooked according to K/E rules with the suggested serving size of 4 oz (raw weight!).



This is what Kimmer said on Kimkins blog today, answering a question whether to do K/E or regular Kimkins:

I prefer original Kimkins because I love veggies and the variety that it gives for low carb cooking. Imagine a plain chicken breast that you plan to grill. OK, but how many can you eat day after day? What about this instead:

  • 1 chicken breast
or
  • chicken + peppers & onions = fajitas
And in standard Kimmer fashion, the photo is taken from a regular recipe found on the web. (Edited: The original picture is found here.)
Looks good, doesn't it? With tortillas and sauces on the side. And plenty of chicken and veggies.



Spending a few minutes in Photoshop, adapting this recipe to Kimkins Diet guidelines results in this picture:


Doesn't look that good anymore, does it? And I still have been generous as this is probably more than 4 oz of chicken and the 1 cup veggies allowed.


Fitday for this meal gives: 136 calories, 2 grams fat, 12 grams carbs, 18 grams protein

Tuesday, February 5, 2008

VLCD (Very Low Calorie Diets)

While all Kimkins Diet Plans are Very Low Calorie, the Shake Plan is the only one that has a given calorie limit. (The other Plans have suggested serving sizes, which automatically makes them low calorie, as shown here: Kimkins Diet Plans.)

It is based on 0 - 4 shakes, max 200 cals/4 carbs each. EAS (100 cals/ea) is the most recommended brand. While the shakes, according to the nutrition information, have added vitamins and minerals, they are clearly labeled "Not intended for meal replacements". Somehow, this fact is never mentioned on kimkins.

From Weight-control Information Network (emphasis mine):

What is a very low-calorie diet?

A very low-calorie diet (VLCD) is a doctor-supervised diet that typically uses commercially prepared formulas to promote rapid weight loss in patients who are obese. These formulas, usually liquid shakes or bars, replace all food intake for several weeks or months. VLCD formulas need to contain appropriate levels of vitamins and micronutrients to ensure that patients meet their nutritional requirements. Some physicians also prescribe very low-calorie diets made up almost entirely of lean protein foods, such as fish and chicken. People on a VLCD consume about 800 calories per day or less.

VLCD formulas are not the same as the meal replacements you can find at grocery stores or pharmacies, which are meant to subsitute for one or two meals a day. Over-the-counter meal replacements such as bars, entrees, or shakes should account for only part of one’s daily calories.

When used under proper medical supervision, VLCDs may produce significant short-term weight loss in patients who are moderately to extremely obese. VLCDs should be part of comprehensive weight-loss treatment programs that include behavioral therapy, nutrition counseling, physical activity, and/or drug treatment.

Who should use a VLCD?

VLCDs are designed to produce rapid weight loss at the start of a weight-loss program in patients with a body mass index (BMI) greater than 30 and significant comorbidities. BMI correlates significantly with total body fat content. It is calculated by dividing a person’s weight in pounds by height in inches squared and multiplied by 703.

Use of VLCDs in patients with a BMI of 27 to 30 should be reserved for those who have medical conditions due to overweight, such as high blood pressure. These diets are not appropriate for children or adolescents, except in specialized treatment programs.

Very little information exists regarding the use of VLCDs in older people. Because people over age 50 already experience depletion of lean body mass, use of a VLCD may not be warranted. Also, people over 50 may not tolerate the side effects associated with VLCDs because of preexisting medical conditions or the need for other medicines. Doctors must evaluate on a case-by-case basis the potential risks and benefits of rapid weight loss in older adults, as well as in patients who have significant medical problems or are on medications.

Health Benefits of a VLCD

A VLCD may allow a patient who is moderately to extremely obese to lose about 3 to 5 pounds per week, for an average total weight loss of 44 pounds over 12 weeks. Such a weight loss can rapidly improve obesity-related medical conditions, including diabetes, high blood pressure, and high cholesterol.

The rapid weight loss experienced by most people on a VLCD can be very motivating. Patients who participate in a VLCD program that includes lifestyle treatment typically lose about 15 to 25 percent of their initial weight during the first 3 to 6 months. They may maintain a 5-percent weight loss after 4 years if they adopt a healthy eating plan and physical activity habits.

Adverse Effects of a VLCD

Many patients on a VLCD for 4 to 16 weeks report minor side effects such as fatigue, constipation, nausea, or diarrhea. These conditions usually improve within a few weeks and rarely prevent patients from completing the program. The most common serious side effect is gallstone formation. Gallstones, which often develop in people who are obese, especially women, are even more common during rapid weight loss. Research indicates that rapid weight loss may increase cholesterol levels in the gallbladder and decrease its ability to contract and expel bile. Some medicines can prevent gallstone formation during rapid weight loss. Your health care provider can determine if these medicines are appropriate for you.

Maintaining Weight Loss

Studies show that the long-term results of VLCDs vary widely, but weight regain is common. Combining a VLCD with behavior therapy, physical activity, and active follow-up treatment may help increase weight loss and prevent weight regain.

In addition, VLCDs may be no more effective than less severe dietary restrictions in the long run. Studies have shown that following a diet of approximately 800 to 1,000 calories produces weight loss similar to that seen with VLCDs. This is probably due to participants’ better compliance with a less restrictive diet.

For most people who are obese, obesity is a long-term condition that requires a lifetime of attention even after formal weight-loss treatment ends. Therefore, health care providers should encourage patients who are obese to commit to permanent changes of healthier eating, regular physical activity, and an improved outlook about food.


Why not avoid yo-yo crash dieting and just do Atkins from the start?


Monday, February 4, 2008

The Gravy Diet

Kimkins has a new competitor on the internet: The Gravy Diet!

How the Gravy Diet works:

While mainstream medical science kept telling people to lose weight by changing their diets and exercising more often, Dr. Morgan kept working towards his dream of providing people with a quickfix diet that would allow people to lose massive amounts of weight quickly, and without exercising.

Soon the Gravy Diet was born.

But how does it work?

Think of gravy as a lubricant -it makes things stick less- and when you eat nothing but gravy, your body loses its "grip" on your stored fats and incoming calories, making them easier to burn and eliminate.

The Gravy Diet works with your body naturally, causing a state Gravy Diet researchers call "diatosis". Diatosis increases your metabolism, while at the same time reduces your absorbsion of incoming calories. Diatosis helps the body eliminate fat-building carbohydrates, fats, and proteins from your diet, causing quick and certain weight loss.

The key to the Gravy Diet is fine tuning your DVI, or Diatosis Volume Index. You'll want to keep your DVI at approximately 1 liter per 10 kilograms of body weight.

Gravy Diet Success Stories:

I've been on diets all my life, and finally I discovered that diets just don't work. Then I read Dr Morgan's book, and I'm a diet believer again! I've lost over 45 pounds!
-John Henderson, Missouri

After years of trying fad diets that promised I could eat all I wanted, not exercise, and still lose weight, I tried the Gravy Diet! Now I can eat all the gravy I want and still lose weight! This is great! I've lost over 75 pounds!
-Mary Manski, North Dakota

By following Dr. Morgan's wonderful diet, I was able to lose well over 200 pounds in just a few weeks. I'm a doctor, and I recomend Dr. Morgan's Gravy Diet to all my patients.
-Dr. Robert Morgan, Texas

I lost a grand total of 2,358 pounds on the Gravy Diet. If I can do it, anybody can.
-Li Mei Choi, Fuzhou, China

Common myths about the Gravy Diet:

Myth #1: The Gravy Diet doesn't work.

It has been conclusively proven that eating nothing but gravy causes a person to lose weight.

Myth #2: The Gravy Diet isn't healthy.

Proponents of this myth haven't been keeping up with recent scientific research which shows that the Gravy Diet is extremely healthy if health is measured by weight loss alone.

Myth #3: The Gravy Diet isn't nutritious.

Nonsense. Properly prepared, gravy contains all the nutrition a person needs. In rare cases nutritional supplements are needed to replenish those nutrients lost to diarrhea, but usually only about 80-99% of those on the Gravy Diet find this necessary.

Myth #4: Constant diarrhea (diatosis) is not good for people.

This is the most common myth. While proponents of this myth will point to numerous anecdotal hospital reports of patients "suffering" from diarrhea, there is no hard scientific link between unhealthy people, diarrhea, and the Gravy Diet.

Myth #5: The same effects can be had by taking simple laxatives.

Nothing could be further from the truth! While it's true that some people have lost weight by inducing diarrhea with laxatives, and that laxatives are sometimes a necessary part of the beginning phases of the Gravy Diet, research has shown that gravy-induced diarrhea is up to 7 times more effective than laxatives alone.

Myth #6: Gravy Dieters just blindly follow Dr. Morgan and worship him as a god.

Many people think Dr Morgan is treated more like a cult leader than a doctor giving medical advice, and many Gravy Dieters are accused of "hero worship". But is this really true? Dr Morgan says it is not, and that He had predicted that His followers would be persecuted by the non-believers.

Myth #7: The world's healthiest, longest lived, and least overweight cultures eat very little gravy.

They just think they're healthy. And what good is living a long time if you're not eating gravy?

The Gravy Train:

As the body of medical evidence supporting the Gravy Diet increases, more and more doctors and scientists "get on the gravy train" and support the gravy diet. Here is a sampling of quotes and excerpts from recent scientific studies on the Gravy Diet.

"The Gravy Diet is Gravylicious."
--Dr. Robert Morgan.

"... gravy ... can be ... an effective tool ... for ... weight loss ..."
--Journal of the American Medical Association.

"Well, yes, if you measure health by weight loss alone then a diet consisting of nothing but gravy and laxatives is 'healthy', but I..."
--US Surgeon General.

"...the patient lost a considerable amount of weight due to constant diarrhea..."
--Mayo Clinic hospital records.

"I really want the Gravy Diet to be true."
--Editor of Gravy Monthly Magazine.

"Diatosis is good."
--Gravy Science.

How does one start Dr. Morgan's Revolutionary Gravy Diet? Just follow this simple four phase plan:

Induction

Buy Dr. Morgan's book "Dr. Morgan's Gravy Diet Revolution".

If starting the Gravy Diet doesn't initiate diatosis naturally, use the proper amount of Dr. Morgan's Laxative Powder.

Weight Loss

If you haven't done so already, buy Dr. Morgan's book "Dr. Morgan's Gravy Diet Revolution".

Once you start shedding those pounds, have fun with your gravy. Try adding different spices.

Begin taking Dr Morgan's SuperGravy Multi-vitamin.

Maintenance

Buy the damn book already.

Once you've reached you target weight, it's important to stick with the diet forever. If you stray too far from a strict gravy diet, the weight will come back almost instantly. Most people have problems with this phase because they find that not being able to ever have candy, bread, rice, pasta, carrots, peanuts, apples, bananas, meats, and fish again a little depressing.

Don't cheat, the effects of the Gravy Diet are eliminated by having a biscuit with your gravy!

Avoid Dying/Spend Money

Taking Dr Morgan's SuperGravy Multi-vitamins can help avoid scurvy and death.

Buy new Gravy Diet books and products.

Remember that Dr. Morgan died for your sins, so pay us money.








Sunday, February 3, 2008

Kimkins Diet Plans

KIMKINS BOOT CAMP
The most popular Kimkins Option!

30 minutes of intense daily exercise required

Breakfast
Up to 2 eggs (cooked without fat)
Up to 1/2 cup List 2 veggies
Up to 2 oz lean ham or other lean protein (raw/cured weight)
Unlimited non-calorie beverage

Lunch
Up to 4 oz lean protein (raw weight)
Up to 2 cups mixed greens + Wishbone Spritzer dressing (or caloric equivalent)
Unlimited non-calorie beverage

Dinner
Up to 4 oz lean protein (raw weight)
Up to 2 cups mixed greens + Wishbone Spritzer dressing (or caloric equivalent)
Unlimited non-calorie beverage

Take a complete multivitamin each day plus other desired supplements

This is the food for one entire day!
Calories: 594
Fat: 26 grams
Carbs: 16 grams
Protein: 74 grams


And split into individual meals:





KIMMER EXPERIMENT (K/E)
K/E is used to reach ketosis quickly or as a jumpstart for other Kimkins Options

As much lean protein as desired from the Kimkins Food List (but remember that serving size is 4 oz, cut to 3 if weight loss is slow!)
Minimal low-carb condiments and spices may be used sparingly
No alcohol, no cheese, no fatty meats, no fats, no veggies
Your appetite will drop naturally after 3-5 days
Take a complete multivitamin each day plus other desired supplements
You may remain on K/E as long as desired


Breakfast, lunch and dinner on one plate:


Total calories for a whole day: 376
(Breakfast is one egg, two egg whites as recommended in the food plans)

Saturday, February 2, 2008

Kimkins Diet Blogs

Many wonder why we bloggers keep on writing about Kimkins, and some call us "haters" and claim that we "don't have a life". For me, the answer is easy. Read Kimkins Survivors

As long as kimkins.com is still up and running, I will keep on blogging about it. I have hope that it will not be too long before we see a "404" when clicking on kimkins.com and at that time I will happily consider in what direction to take this blog. However, my anti-kimkins posts will remain as information for new dieters that have not followed the story.

A bulletin board I came across yesterday showed me the difference blogs are making. Remember that in June 2007, when the WW magazine came out, there was no anti-Kimkins blogs on the internet but plenty of pro-Kimkins articles.

The BB posts, starting on September 12:

Subject: Kimkins anyone?
Poster: Kimkins affiliate
DH and i just signed up today. We are going to start on Sunday. I realize it is extreme but we are all or nothing people and we need to make a major change. It was only $60 for a lifetime membership with no additional fees, ever. All foods can be purchased at any local market. It's dramatic but simple (and my doctor said it would be ok).

Has anyone else heard of or tried this plan?

Moderator:
No, but I'm intrigued!!
I did atkins years ago and lost 30 pounds in about 2 months. I stopped it and gained the weight RIGHT back but it wasn't because I incorporated carbs, it was because I incorporated the junk food back in.

This is low fat and lower calorie.....hum...interesting. I'm going to have to read more about this!

You just might have a buddy!!

Moderator 1/2 an hour later:
So I was REALLY intrigued so I've been googling Kimkins for the past couple of hours. I'm not finding good things about it. Sounds like a clever marketing ploy that uses fake before and after pictures.

http://www.slamboard.com/2007/06/30/kimkinscom-part-i-the-kimkinscom-business-partnership-case-study/

I'm still looking though. If I find more I will.
Sometimes I have to realize that if it sounds too good or too easy, it probably is.

Moderator 5 minutes later:
I found more...

http://kimkinsexposed2.wordpress.com/

I'm thinking this is most definitely a scam - here is another link...
http://www.3fatchicks.com/Diets/Diet...f_a_Diet_Scam/

OMG!! If you read the above link, this is the part that scares me the most =
Dangers of the Kimkins Diet
Many Kimkins followers have been complaining of serious side effects from the plan including hair loss, heart palpitations, fainting, confusion, and more. When approached about these problems, they claim Kimmer brushed them off, saying they were not the result of the plan and the member must be cheating. Go lower in calories and you'll be fine. In the published email exchange between Kimmer and one of her staff, Kimmer stated that she couldn't help it if the members were "too stupid" to go to a doctor.

The plan promotes pro-anorexia techniques to get followers to stick with the plan, such as laxative abuse. Kimmer recommends regular use of laxatives to her members. She attempts to justify this by pointing out that one of her members was prescribed laxatives by her doctor, so that must mean it's safe. Only that member and her doctor know what kind of problem she had that required a laxative, and if that laxative was to be used more than once. Regular use of laxatives is very dangerous, and could result dehydration, electrolyte imbalance, and even laxative dependence.

If your teenage daughter decided to cut calories that drastically and take laxatives, how would you react? You'd worry she had an eating disorder, and you'd seek help for her before her health suffered. You love her, you're a good mother. Why would you treat yourself any differently?

And I keep finding more!!
Please get your money back - this is awful. All the links I am finding are attached to the above in someway.

Affiliate 3 hours later:
Thanks for the info. I admit I never searched it out online because it was recommended to me by a friend who has lost weight on the plan. I ran it past my doctor and she said it was like a healthier version of Adkins.

After reading your posts I scoured the site for anything "fishy" and all I see is the basics super low cal, super low fat, super low carb plan. Members post about constipation and ask for remedies that will not "stall" their weightless but I don't see anything at all that promotes laxative abuse or anorexia.

I’m going to have to give this some serious thought. While I want to lose weight, I don’t want to risk my health.

BTW- They are clear about no refunds when you sign up because once you do all of their trade "secrets" are online.

Moderator 2, the following day:
* Permanent weight loss is not about finding a quick fix diet, but making a commitment to life style changes that include nutrition and exercise
* Any weight loss program you choose must pass the “Can I eat that way for the rest of my life?” test,
* The weight loss program you choose should ultimately teach you how to eat and be self reliant so you can make informed long term choices about your nutrition.
* The weight loss program you choose should not leave you reliant on commercial bars, shakes, supplements, or pre-made foods, for your long term success.
* The weight loss program you choose must have an effective exercise component.
* The weight loss program you choose should attempt to help with motivation, goal setting, and support, but can’t be a replacement for psychological counseling if needed.

Affiliate, one day later:
Thank you for your thoughtful response. When I signed up I had no idea what the plan was about. I was going based upon a friends recommendation. I did ask my doctor about it but she must not be as informed as I had thought/hoped. I am so grateful that you are looking out for my lazy self.

I am committed to healthy weight loss. I can't get my money back but I wont be "doing" the plan.


This story had a happy ending thanks to a moderator that did the research and thanks to the anti-Kimkins bloggers that provided the information. Just imagine if this conversation had taken place just 3 months earlier. At that time, there were no anti-kimkins blogs and most likely a large number of dieters on this bulletin board would have jumped on the Kimkins wagon and later ended up as a page on the Kimkins Survivor blog.